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Message 40934 - Posted: 24 Apr 2015 | 3:42:48 UTC
Last modified: 24 Apr 2015 | 3:44:15 UTC

I now have an Asus GTX 750 Ti card. It's now 4 months after I bought it, and it still doesn't work. The first two months, I didn't have the right type of power cable ready. The third month, I found that the VGA output was disabled at initial startup, so my monitor wouldn't allow me to see anything. I then found a DVI-D connector on my monitor, so I ordered a DVI-D cable. The fourth month, it would display a picture for about one minute on bootup, then go black, but would ignore the keyboard input needed to make the bootup proceed, so I suspect that it somehow stopped the bootup from reaching the point where the keyboard could be used.

Asus provides a number to call for graphics board problems, but not a toll-free number, so I'm likely to have a significant next telephone bill (perhaps two hours on hold).

Their technical support department insists that their GTX 750 Ti uses far more power than the Nvidia specs call far - 350 watts compared to 60 watts, and therefore need a power supply with a greater wattage than the Nvidia specs call for to run the whole computer (650 compared to 300). My computer room doesn't have that much extra power available; it's probably already sometimes using more than enough to trip the circuit breaker if there was no time delay to smooth out the peaks. I've asked about running another circuit to my computer room; the circuit breaker panel has no room for another circuit breaker, so that's not reasonable.

I've already found two more users on Primegrid who've had severe problems using Asus boards.

How many other users here are having severe problems using Asus boards? How many are getting them to work well? Is the ratio of these two bad enough that we need to consider Asus boards about as bad as Dell computers?

What other brands of graphics boards work well? It looks like I'll have to buy another GTX 750 Ti card, but of a different brand, to get one of my computers doing GPU workunits again.

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Message 40937 - Posted: 24 Apr 2015 | 9:02:31 UTC - in response to Message 40934.

The first two months, I didn't have the right type of power cable ready.

If you purchase hardware that you can't properly connect and it takes you two months to get a cable you really can't blame anyone for that.

The third month, I found that the VGA output was disabled at initial startup, so my monitor wouldn't allow me to see anything. I then found a DVI-D connector on my monitor, so I ordered a DVI-D cable. The fourth month, it would display a picture for about one minute on bootup, then go black, but would ignore the keyboard input needed to make the bootup proceed, so I suspect that it somehow stopped the bootup from reaching the point where the keyboard could be used.

Sorry, I can't really comment on this. The screen going black could mean there's insufficient power but it could as well be something else IMO.

Their technical support department insists that their GTX 750 Ti uses far more power than the Nvidia specs call far - 350 watts compared to 60 watts

That must have been some kind of misunderstanding. I'm sure they meant to recommend a PSU with 350 watts total. The GPU alone just can't draw that much power. That's impossible. You should be fine with a good 350W PSU, assuming nothing else is taking too much power. Myself, I'm running seven CPU cores and a MSI GTX750 (no Ti) with that no problem. A 300W PSU could be close depending on your individual hardware, especially if it's a cheap one.

I've already found two more users on Primegrid who've had severe problems using Asus boards.

How many other users here are having severe problems using Asus boards? How many are getting them to work well? Is the ratio of these two bad enough that we need to consider Asus boards about as bad as Dell computers?

What other brands of graphics boards work well?

I've only ever had problems with one graphics board. That was a Powercolor, and years ago. Everything else always worked fine for me, including Asus.

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Message 40938 - Posted: 24 Apr 2015 | 10:27:12 UTC - in response to Message 40934.

If you bought this card new then I would go to the shop and swap for a new one as it is still under warranty. Or they check and repair it if possible and if not give you a new one.

I have many hardware from ASUS including GPU's and everything did work immediately after I installed it. I think that ASUS can be considered as a very good brand. And that is also true for Dell, I run several Dell's without issues.

However my favorite brand is EVGA, and nowadays I only buy GPU, MOBO and PSU from EVGA, for replacements or new builds.

But your ASUS GTX750 should work, go back to the shop.
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Message 40939 - Posted: 24 Apr 2015 | 10:52:27 UTC - in response to Message 40934.
Last modified: 24 Apr 2015 | 11:03:48 UTC

I now have an Asus GTX 750 Ti card. It's now 4 months after I bought it, and it still doesn't work. The first two months, I didn't have the right type of power cable ready. The third month, I found that the VGA output was disabled at initial startup, so my monitor wouldn't allow me to see anything. I then found a DVI-D connector on my monitor, so I ordered a DVI-D cable. The fourth month, it would display a picture for about one minute on bootup, then go black, but would ignore the keyboard input needed to make the bootup proceed, so I suspect that it somehow stopped the bootup from reaching the point where the keyboard could be used.


Is this the only gpu in the machine? Wndows has a very bad habit of disabling resources that it thinks aren't being used during startup, a gpu with no monitor attached is a good example of that. A simple "dummy plug" can fix that.
http://www.overclock.net/t/384733/the-30-second-dummy-plug A second option is to plug in a 2nd monitor during the startup process and then unplug it once windows is up and running.

My computer room doesn't have that much extra power available; it's probably already sometimes using more than enough to trip the circuit breaker if there was no time delay to smooth out the peaks. I've asked about running another circuit to my computer room; the circuit breaker panel has no room for another circuit breaker, so that's not reasonable.


Same problem I had, call an electrician you may be able to get double breakers that put two breakers in the same slot a single breaker is in right now. I ended up getting three new 20amp circuits for my basement pc's that way.

Their technical support department insists that their GTX 750 Ti uses far more power than the Nvidia specs call far - 350 watts compared to 60 watts, and therefore need a power supply with a greater wattage than the Nvidia specs call for to run the whole computer (650 compared to 300)


Buy yourself a "kill-a-watt" device, Walmart sells them for about 20 bucks US, and plug it into the wall and then plug your pc into it, this will tell you exactly how much wattage your pc is drawing. Remember though startup usually takes more wattage then the just running does. Most people upgrade their power supplies when they start gpu crunching as most pc makers put in the minimum wattage power supply they can get away with when they make a pc, it is cheaper and their profit margins are higher. There is no need to put in an 850 watt power supply for most people who will never need one if the pc is only drawing 235 watts as it comes off the line. Dell is notorious for this, they will put in a 125 watt power supply if the machine only draws 100 watts.

I have a gpu, or two, in almost all of my machinea and every one has had the power supply upgraded to a 750 or 850 watt one. Yes it's overkill, but you don't want to be pushing the power supply to it's limits when crunching 24/7/365 for 5 years or so. I run AMD 7970 gpu's and Nvidia 760 gpu's.

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Message 40943 - Posted: 24 Apr 2015 | 13:14:53 UTC - in response to Message 40939.

Is this the only gpu in the machine? Wndows has a very bad habit of disabling resources that it thinks aren't being used during startup, a gpu with no monitor attached is a good example of that. A simple "dummy plug" can fix that.
http://www.overclock.net/t/384733/the-30-second-dummy-plug A second option is to plug in a 2nd monitor during the startup process and then unplug it once windows is up and running.


If there's a second GPU, it's on the motherboard and its video connector is well hidden. There's no motherboard slot suitable for adding any more. I don't have an extra monitor or room to add one.

I thought only AMD/ATI boards needed the dummy plug.

Same problem I had, call an electrician you may be able to get double breakers that put two breakers in the same slot a single breaker is in right now. I ended up getting three new 20amp circuits for my basement pc's that way.


The electrician who came to do the estimate of how much it would cost to add a second circuit should have known if double breakers were available for that type of circuit breaker panel, even if I didn't know to ask.

Buy yourself a "kill-a-watt" device, Walmart sells them for about 20 bucks US, and plug it into the wall and then plug your pc into it, this will tell you exactly how much wattage your pc is drawing. Remember though startup usually takes more wattage then the just running does. Most people upgrade their power supplies when they start gpu crunching as most pc makers put in the minimum wattage power supply they can get away with when they make a pc, it is cheaper and their profit margins are higher. There is no need to put in an 850 watt power supply for most people who will never need one if the pc is only drawing 235 watts as it comes off the line. Dell is notorious for this, they will put in a 125 watt power supply if the machine only draws 100 watts.


Not needed - the UPS I use for that computer includes the equivalent. It says that the computer uses up to 170 watts when running BOINC on 7 CPU cores and barely using the previous graphics card, which probably needs heatsink cleaning, but the heatsink is unreachable. It's a GT 440, with Nvidia specs that say it can use 65 watts. When I let BOINC use that card, it used to work but now soon overheats.

I have a gpu, or two, in almost all of my machinea and every one has had the power supply upgraded to a 750 or 850 watt one. Yes it's overkill, but you don't want to be pushing the power supply to it's limits when crunching 24/7/365 for 5 years or so. I run AMD 7970 gpu's and Nvidia 760 gpu's.


The computer's from HP, so I assume they used an adequate power supply for the previous video card; the new video card uses 5 watts less. I'll consider upgrading the power supply if I can first get another circuit added. Probably only to 450 watts though, since HP provides a part number for a suitable 450 watt power supply, but no higher. The computer's frame doesn't leave enough room to use an GTX 760.

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Message 40950 - Posted: 25 Apr 2015 | 11:39:41 UTC - in response to Message 40943.


Not needed - the UPS I use for that computer includes the equivalent. It says that the computer uses up to 170 watts when running BOINC on 7 CPU cores and barely using the previous graphics card, which probably needs heatsink cleaning, but the heatsink is unreachable. It's a GT 440, with Nvidia specs that say it can use 65 watts. When I let BOINC use that card, it used to work but now soon overheats.


Can you remove the card and just blow it out well with a can of compressed air?


The computer's from HP, so I assume they used an adequate power supply for the previous video card; the new video card uses 5 watts less. I'll consider upgrading the power supply if I can first get another circuit added. Probably only to 450 watts though, since HP provides a part number for a suitable 450 watt power supply, but no higher. The computer's frame doesn't leave enough room to use an GTX 760.


I'm not sure you need to stick with an HP brand power supply but that doesn't make alot of difference, except for cost, since you are case limited in your gpu options anyway. If you are unsure if another brand will work I would just stick with the known HP one that will fit.

Since you are still having problems with the gpu have you tried plugging in a different one, or even just a cheap one in the same slot and see if the pc boots up just fine? If so you probably should be calling for a warranty replacement and just end this. If not then it could be a motherboard problem and then you have bigger problems. The one other thing I would do is unplug everything you don't need to boot up the pc, the network cable, the printer if any, the cd/dvd, anything except the hard drive, gpu, mouse and keyboard just to see if it works then. If so start plugging things back in again, when the machine is off of course, restart and see what is causing your problems.

Do you have a power supply tester? It's possible the power supply isn't up to snuff anymore, have you blown it out lately too? Be extremely careful if you use a compressor to blow things out, it's very easy to over speed fans and stuff and make things worse, cans of compressed air are best.

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Message 40951 - Posted: 25 Apr 2015 | 14:37:55 UTC
Last modified: 25 Apr 2015 | 14:38:36 UTC

I have six Asus GTX 750 Tis on a variety of Haswell Z87/Z97 motherboards (Gigabyte and Asrock), 2 cards per boards. They work great, and the part about needing a larger power supply is total nonsense, as has been mentioned above.

However, the black screen is another matter. I suspect a BIOS incompatibility there, especially if it is an older motherboard. If your motherboard has a BIOS update, then try it. Just buying a different brand of video card may not fix it.

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Message 40952 - Posted: 25 Apr 2015 | 15:05:56 UTC

Is this the only gpu in the machine? Wndows has a very bad habit of disabling resources that it thinks aren't being used during startup, a gpu with no monitor attached is a good example of that. A simple "dummy plug" can fix that.
http://www.overclock.net/t/384733/the-30-second-dummy-plug A second option is to plug in a 2nd monitor during the startup process and then unplug it once windows is up and running.


Monitor attachment or dummy plug is not needed. I have several rigs with monitors only connected to the first (main) GPU, and the other GPU works just fine without.
This is under windows.
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Message 40953 - Posted: 25 Apr 2015 | 19:02:07 UTC - in response to Message 40950.
Last modified: 25 Apr 2015 | 19:03:31 UTC

Can you remove the card and just blow it out well with a can of compressed air?

It's fairly easy to remove, and I have some cans of compressed something, so I may try that. I can't see where to aim it in the old card, though.

I'm not sure you need to stick with an HP brand power supply but that doesn't make alot of difference, except for cost, since you are case limited in your gpu options anyway. If you are unsure if another brand will work I would just stick with the known HP one that will fit.

The main reason why I am thinking of sticking with an HP power supply is that I do not have sufficient information on how to choose some other power supply that will fit that case and is also compatible with that motherboard. Also, the computer room is too close to tripping its circuit breaker to really consider a power supply with a higher rating, unless I decide to stop running both my desktops at the same time.

Since you are still having problems with the gpu have you tried plugging in a different one, or even just a cheap one in the same slot and see if the pc boots up just fine? If so you probably should be calling for a warranty replacement and just end this. If not then it could be a motherboard problem and then you have bigger problems. The one other thing I would do is unplug everything you don't need to boot up the pc, the network cable, the printer if any, the cd/dvd, anything except the hard drive, gpu, mouse and keyboard just to see if it works then. If so start plugging things back in again, when the machine is off of course, restart and see what is causing your problems.

It boots up just fine with the old GT 440, but that card easily overheats if I let BOINC use it. I don't have any other graphics cards that should work with a 300 watt power supply.

Do you have a power supply tester? It's possible the power supply isn't up to snuff anymore, have you blown it out lately too? Be extremely careful if you use a compressor to blow things out, it's very easy to over speed fans and stuff and make things worse, cans of compressed air are best.

I do not have a power supply tester or a compressor.

Yesterday, I tested the new card in my other desktop, which has a 450 watt power supply. It booted and worked properly with light use; a GPU workunit already in progress on that computer was not at a point where I considered it reasonable to test the board for CUDA or OpenCL use.

Since it appears that my computer room will not allow both upgrading the power supply and continuing to use both desktops at once, I consider it best to ask about two other possibilities I've thought of before doing much.

1. The computer where the new board works uses a BIOS and runs 64-bit Windows Vista. The computer where it doesn't work uses a UEFI instead and runs 64-bit Windows 7. Does this have anything to do which which board should work and which shouldn't?

2. Each DVI-D connector is supposed to be able to run two monitors. If the initial startup of the Asus GTX 750 Ti turns on only one of them, perhaps one of the monitors uses only the half that is not turned on, but the other monitor uses the one that is turned on. Is this reasonable? I'm thinking of buying a longer DVI-D cable so I can try the equivalent of switching the monitors.

I've thought of running a separate electrical circuit to my computer room, using a separate circuit breaker. The circuit breaker panel does not have room for another circuit breaker, or I would already be arranging that.

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Message 40955 - Posted: 25 Apr 2015 | 22:12:33 UTC - in response to Message 40953.

1. The computer where the new board works uses a BIOS and runs 64-bit Windows Vista. The computer where it doesn't work uses a UEFI instead and runs 64-bit Windows 7. Does this have anything to do which which board should work and which shouldn't?

My Haswell motherboards use a UEFI bios, so that in itself is not a problem. And I use Win7 64-bit on all my machines, so that isn't it either. However, I did have some stability problems (not a black screen fortunately) on my Gigabyte board when running two GTX 750 Tis until I updated to the latest BIOS, which is still listed as beta on their website. Whether that might be available for your PC is another matter.

Another brand of card might work, but it is hit or miss at that point. Good luck.

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Message 40956 - Posted: 26 Apr 2015 | 2:05:57 UTC - in response to Message 40955.

Another brand of card might work, but it is hit or miss at that point. Good luck.


Since it uses a UEFI instead of a BIOS, I'll look for an updated UEFI instead.

Thanks.

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Message 40957 - Posted: 26 Apr 2015 | 11:40:53 UTC - in response to Message 40953.

Can you remove the card and just blow it out well with a can of compressed air?


It's fairly easy to remove, and I have some cans of compressed something, so I may try that. I can't see where to aim it in the old card, though.


At all the edges of the card and any fans holes you see too, basically all around the card where you can get any air into it. If it has an onboard fan spin it too with the can of air, hopefully it spins up quickly and easily, do not keep it running at full speed for more than a few seconds though.

As for the rest I have not had any problems with the older or newer bios's, I also run Win7 64bit on most of my machines, with Win7 32bit running on a couple and Windows Home Server running on another couple. I run WHS because it is cheap and because I need a Server to 'take control' of my local ip addresses when I power up too many devices. My two Servers are essentially Boinc only machines that just crunch and manage stuff in the background. I will probably shut the oldest one down because of my newest machine, a 16 core pc running Win7 64 bit.

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Message 40962 - Posted: 26 Apr 2015 | 16:13:19 UTC - in response to Message 40956.

Another brand of card might work, but it is hit or miss at that point. Good luck.


Since it uses a UEFI instead of a BIOS, I'll look for an updated UEFI instead.

The terminology is a bit confusing, and I don't claim to be an expert. I think that you are correct that UEFI is not BIOS, but is the successor. However, in my Gigabyte Z87 motherboard manual, it refers to it as "BIOS" that can be booted into either the UEFI or Legacy mode, depending on the OS. I think that "Legacy" refers to BIOS used in Win7, and it is really only Windows 8 that uses UEFI mode. But whatever they call the firmware on your motherboard, and update might help, and so might a different video card, but there is unfortunately no guarantee.

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Message 40965 - Posted: 27 Apr 2015 | 5:12:18 UTC

If any of you have made a GTX 750 Ti card do GPUGRID workunits properly, what brand of GTX 750 Ti card did you use?

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Message 40968 - Posted: 27 Apr 2015 | 10:47:19 UTC - in response to Message 40962.

Another brand of card might work, but it is hit or miss at that point. Good luck.


Since it uses a UEFI instead of a BIOS, I'll look for an updated UEFI instead.

The terminology is a bit confusing, and I don't claim to be an expert. I think that you are correct that UEFI is not BIOS, but is the successor. However, in my Gigabyte Z87 motherboard manual, it refers to it as "BIOS" that can be booted into either the UEFI or Legacy mode, depending on the OS. I think that "Legacy" refers to BIOS used in Win7, and it is really only Windows 8 that uses UEFI mode. But whatever they call the firmware on your motherboard, and update might help, and so might a different video card, but there is unfortunately no guarantee.


Rumor has it that the final version of Win10 will require a UEFI system, but the preview works just fine on my regular bios right now.

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Message 40975 - Posted: 28 Apr 2015 | 20:43:52 UTC - in response to Message 40965.

If any of you have made a GTX 750 Ti card do GPUGRID workunits properly, what brand of GTX 750 Ti card did you use?


I run 7 (PNY) GeForce GTX 750 Ti Graphics Card - 2GB, GDDR5, 5400 MHz
Great card; without needing any additional power.

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Message 40976 - Posted: 29 Apr 2015 | 3:49:46 UTC

Can any of you with both an Asus graphics card and a device for measuring the amount of power the whole computer uses let me know how much power the computer plus the Asus card uses when running some GPU workunit? I've thought of the possibility that the extra power requirement for the Asus cards could be only during bootup.

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Message 40977 - Posted: 29 Apr 2015 | 7:49:15 UTC

Running two GTX 750 Tis on a Gigabyte Z87 with a Haswell i7-4771 (two cores supporting the GPU, four cores on other BOINC projects and two cores free) draws about 234 watts from the wall. That is with a Gold 90+ percent efficient power supply. I don't think the startup current is the problem, or you would not see the initial screen at all; any surge would be less than a second or two.

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Message 41431 - Posted: 28 Jun 2015 | 4:30:41 UTC

I've now tried a second GTX 750 Ti, EVGA brand. It doesn't allow booting either, even though the EVGA specs say a 300 watt power supply is adequate.

The EVGA customer service department has a very different idea of what is going wrong, though - a BIOS that just won't handle booting with a GTX 750 Ti (any brand) installed. They pointed me to a site for downloading updates specific to this model of computer; I tried the BIOS update offered there and it made no difference.

I looked into returning the ASUS GTX 750 Ti; the online store only allows such returns within 30 days after buying them, and only for getting another board of the same model rather than returning the money.

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Message 41433 - Posted: 28 Jun 2015 | 7:26:35 UTC - in response to Message 41431.

I contacted HP, trying to get another BIOS update that allows it to boot with a GTX 750 Ti. The answer was that the motherboard of that computer is not compatible with any Nvidia-based graphics board more recent than a GTX 550i, which implies that I can no longer make that computer run GPUGRID GPU workunits.

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Message 41434 - Posted: 28 Jun 2015 | 8:32:16 UTC - in response to Message 41433.

Ironic that the bad brand turned out to be a system OEM/motherboard manufacturer!
They are so desperate to retain their customers that they design their components to be incompatible with officially recognised standards. Half the time components don't even fit.
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Message 41437 - Posted: 28 Jun 2015 | 14:12:06 UTC
Last modified: 28 Jun 2015 | 14:12:59 UTC

After looking at the websites mentioned when I contacted HP last night, I decided that the person I contacted at HP last night does not know the difference between the hardware options I could have chosen when ordering that computer from HP and the hardware upgrades I could have bought and applied later, not necessarily from HP. The boss of their customer service department was asking for feedback on how the support went, so I sent that information to him this morning. I'm hoping that this will persuade HP to offer another BIOS upgrade for that model of computer that will allow booting with a GTX 750 Ti card, but I'm not sure how much to hope for this.

I've thought of another possibility to investigate - buy a new power supply for each of my desktop computers with the wattage rating of the one currently in the other computer, install those, and at the same time, swap the graphics cards between the computers. This won't increase the total power needed to run both computers, but if the other desktop will boot with a GTX 750 Ti, may allow me to resume running GPUGRID GPU workunits on the other desktop.

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Message 41441 - Posted: 28 Jun 2015 | 19:08:28 UTC - in response to Message 41437.

Card swapping sounds like you best shot there.
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Message 41442 - Posted: 29 Jun 2015 | 11:22:51 UTC - in response to Message 41437.

After looking at the websites mentioned when I contacted HP last night, I decided that the person I contacted at HP last night does not know the difference between the hardware options I could have chosen when ordering that computer from HP and the hardware upgrades I could have bought and applied later, not necessarily from HP. The boss of their customer service department was asking for feedback on how the support went, so I sent that information to him this morning. I'm hoping that this will persuade HP to offer another BIOS upgrade for that model of computer that will allow booting with a GTX 750 Ti card, but I'm not sure how much to hope for this.

I've thought of another possibility to investigate - buy a new power supply for each of my desktop computers with the wattage rating of the one currently in the other computer, install those, and at the same time, swap the graphics cards between the computers. This won't increase the total power needed to run both computers, but if the other desktop will boot with a GTX 750 Ti, may allow me to resume running GPUGRID GPU workunits on the other desktop.


That brings up an interesting possibility for you...instead of doing ALL that buying and swapping how about taking the troublesome Asus card and swap it into the pc with the biggest power supply right now? If it works you have found that the 300 watt psu you are using is not big enough and you have a solution. BUT if it doesn't work then you are faced with the very real possibility that the card is just faulty.

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Message 41445 - Posted: 29 Jun 2015 | 13:08:54 UTC - in response to Message 41442.
Last modified: 29 Jun 2015 | 13:13:51 UTC

After looking at the websites mentioned when I contacted HP last night, I decided that the person I contacted at HP last night does not know the difference between the hardware options I could have chosen when ordering that computer from HP and the hardware upgrades I could have bought and applied later, not necessarily from HP. The boss of their customer service department was asking for feedback on how the support went, so I sent that information to him this morning. I'm hoping that this will persuade HP to offer another BIOS upgrade for that model of computer that will allow booting with a GTX 750 Ti card, but I'm not sure how much to hope for this.

I've thought of another possibility to investigate - buy a new power supply for each of my desktop computers with the wattage rating of the one currently in the other computer, install those, and at the same time, swap the graphics cards between the computers. This won't increase the total power needed to run both computers, but if the other desktop will boot with a GTX 750 Ti, may allow me to resume running GPUGRID GPU workunits on the other desktop.


That brings up an interesting possibility for you...instead of doing ALL that buying and swapping how about taking the troublesome Asus card and swap it into the pc with the biggest power supply right now? If it works you have found that the 300 watt psu you are using is not big enough and you have a solution. BUT if it doesn't work then you are faced with the very real possibility that the card is just faulty.


That means that I have to stop running BOINC, or anything else, on the computer showing the problem. I've done it long enough to show that the ASUS card works in the other computer, but do not plan to make it permanent.

The graphics card in the computer with the biggest power supply needs too much power to run on the other computer, and the computer room does not supply enough power to just put a bigger power supply in the computer with the problem and still run both computers at the same time.

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Message 41447 - Posted: 30 Jun 2015 | 11:11:31 UTC - in response to Message 41445.

After looking at the websites mentioned when I contacted HP last night, I decided that the person I contacted at HP last night does not know the difference between the hardware options I could have chosen when ordering that computer from HP and the hardware upgrades I could have bought and applied later, not necessarily from HP. The boss of their customer service department was asking for feedback on how the support went, so I sent that information to him this morning. I'm hoping that this will persuade HP to offer another BIOS upgrade for that model of computer that will allow booting with a GTX 750 Ti card, but I'm not sure how much to hope for this.

I've thought of another possibility to investigate - buy a new power supply for each of my desktop computers with the wattage rating of the one currently in the other computer, install those, and at the same time, swap the graphics cards between the computers. This won't increase the total power needed to run both computers, but if the other desktop will boot with a GTX 750 Ti, may allow me to resume running GPUGRID GPU workunits on the other desktop.


That brings up an interesting possibility for you...instead of doing ALL that buying and swapping how about taking the troublesome Asus card and swap it into the pc with the biggest power supply right now? If it works you have found that the 300 watt psu you are using is not big enough and you have a solution. BUT if it doesn't work then you are faced with the very real possibility that the card is just faulty.


That means that I have to stop running BOINC, or anything else, on the computer showing the problem. I've done it long enough to show that the ASUS card works in the other computer, but do not plan to make it permanent.

The graphics card in the computer with the biggest power supply needs too much power to run on the other computer, and the computer room does not supply enough power to just put a bigger power supply in the computer with the problem and still run both computers at the same time.


So the card DOES work, when you put it in the other machine with the bigger power supply, but it won't work in the machine with the smaller power supply, did I get that right so far? AND you can't put a bigger power supply in the 2nd machine because the circuits won't handle it, again right? Sounds you may be in a pickle then until you either run a new circuit for the pc that needs the bigger power supply, or put that pc somewhere else.

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Message 41448 - Posted: 30 Jun 2015 | 13:11:01 UTC - in response to Message 41447.

After looking at the websites mentioned when I contacted HP last night, I decided that the person I contacted at HP last night does not know the difference between the hardware options I could have chosen when ordering that computer from HP and the hardware upgrades I could have bought and applied later, not necessarily from HP. The boss of their customer service department was asking for feedback on how the support went, so I sent that information to him this morning. I'm hoping that this will persuade HP to offer another BIOS upgrade for that model of computer that will allow booting with a GTX 750 Ti card, but I'm not sure how much to hope for this.

I've thought of another possibility to investigate - buy a new power supply for each of my desktop computers with the wattage rating of the one currently in the other computer, install those, and at the same time, swap the graphics cards between the computers. This won't increase the total power needed to run both computers, but if the other desktop will boot with a GTX 750 Ti, may allow me to resume running GPUGRID GPU workunits on the other desktop.


That brings up an interesting possibility for you...instead of doing ALL that buying and swapping how about taking the troublesome Asus card and swap it into the pc with the biggest power supply right now? If it works you have found that the 300 watt psu you are using is not big enough and you have a solution. BUT if it doesn't work then you are faced with the very real possibility that the card is just faulty.


That means that I have to stop running BOINC, or anything else, on the computer showing the problem. I've done it long enough to show that the ASUS card works in the other computer, but do not plan to make it permanent.

The graphics card in the computer with the biggest power supply needs too much power to run on the other computer, and the computer room does not supply enough power to just put a bigger power supply in the computer with the problem and still run both computers at the same time.


So the card DOES work, when you put it in the other machine with the bigger power supply, but it won't work in the machine with the smaller power supply, did I get that right so far? AND you can't put a bigger power supply in the 2nd machine because the circuits won't handle it, again right? Sounds you may be in a pickle then until you either run a new circuit for the pc that needs the bigger power supply, or put that pc somewhere else.


I've looked into adding another circuit. The circuit breaker box does not have room for another circuit breaker, so that would be difficult and expensive. Moving to a different building that already has another circuit might be a possibility.

I do not have a suitable place to move one of the computers to.

It currently looks like a BIOS update, rather than a bigger power supply, is what is actually needed. I'm looking into getting HP to produce one; the one already available does not help.

If that fails, the cheapest alternative appears to be getting each computer a new power supply with the rating of the one currently in the other computer, and when they are installed, moving the video card of the other computer to this computer and installing one of the GTX 750 Tis in the other computer.

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Message 41458 - Posted: 1 Jul 2015 | 11:54:01 UTC - in response to Message 41448.


I've looked into adding another circuit. The circuit breaker box does not have room for another circuit breaker, so that would be difficult and expensive. Moving to a different building that already has another circuit might be a possibility.


Talk to an electrician, they make double breakers that will fit where a single breaker does now, they take up the same space as one but are actually 2 separate circuits. My own electrician was able to do that for me and I now have 3 20amp circuits just for my pc's.

There is such a thing as drawing too much thru the whole circuit breaker box, but again your electrician can help you decide what is or is not possible.

Mine even added a 'whole house surge suppressor' so no more outlet strips with them built into it. It also means my every outlet in my house is on the surge suppressor! It was about $150 US dollars installed for me because he was in there anyway.

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Message 41461 - Posted: 1 Jul 2015 | 20:36:45 UTC - in response to Message 41458.
Last modified: 1 Jul 2015 | 20:40:56 UTC


I've looked into adding another circuit. The circuit breaker box does not have room for another circuit breaker, so that would be difficult and expensive. Moving to a different building that already has another circuit might be a possibility.


Talk to an electrician, they make double breakers that will fit where a single breaker does now, they take up the same space as one but are actually 2 separate circuits. My own electrician was able to do that for me and I now have 3 20amp circuits just for my pc's.

There is such a thing as drawing too much thru the whole circuit breaker box, but again your electrician can help you decide what is or is not possible.

Mine even added a 'whole house surge suppressor' so no more outlet strips with them built into it. It also means my every outlet in my house is on the surge suppressor! It was about $150 US dollars installed for me because he was in there anyway.


I already talked to an electrician. Apparently. there are no double circuit breakers available that will fit into that type of circuit breaker box.

I talked to HP today, second level technical support. He said that the motherboard used in that computer is incompatible with the GTX 750 Tis I was trying to install, and probably with all the other graphics cards that GPUGRID workunits are still able to use.

I tried a Google search for that motherboard (a Pegatron IPISB-CH2) and found many other people complaining about problems using that motherboard with GTX 700 series graphics cards, and no one reporting success doing it.

I've thought of replacing the motherboard with a newer one more likely to work with newer graphics cards, and decided that I just don't have enough information on how to match motherboards to the rest of computers to be likely to choose a suitable motherboard without buying an entire computer with the parts already matched.

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Message 41503 - Posted: 8 Jul 2015 | 0:49:35 UTC

Brands i kinda trust.
Asus
EVGA
MSI
Zotac (not really sure about this one)

Brands that are on the warning list for me.
Powercolor
Gigabytes (sometimes there make shit stuff.)
XFX
PNY

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Message 41515 - Posted: 10 Jul 2015 | 3:32:12 UTC

I thought about replacing the power supply in each computer with one of the rating of the one in the other computer, so I could make more changes without increasing the total power used.

HP offers only one wattage rating for the one currently with no problems, and I don't have sufficient information to choose one that HP does not list.

I've asked if a nearby apartment building has two circuit breakers, rather than just one, per apartment. The owner isn't sure, but plans to ask someone else.

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Message 41520 - Posted: 10 Jul 2015 | 19:51:15 UTC - in response to Message 41515.
Last modified: 10 Jul 2015 | 20:01:13 UTC

In the UK most small houses and apartments have about 7 circuit breakers.
Separate loops for high Wattage electric stoves and showers (usually 7.5mm cable).
In a house, upstairs and downstairs lighting and sockets are usually separate.
10A, 16A, 20 and 40Amp fuses are common for our 240V loops/rings. Even a 10A ring has the potential to deliver up to 2.4KW.
40A tends only to be used for ovens and showers which are typically 6 to 8.5KW.
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Message 41524 - Posted: 12 Jul 2015 | 5:54:06 UTC
Last modified: 12 Jul 2015 | 5:55:40 UTC

I'm in a rather small apartment, not a house, and with no upstairs.

The circuit breaker panel for the whole building has about 3 dozen circuit breakers, with no room to add more. Each of the 16 apartments has one 15 amp breaker, 120 volts, for both its lights and its outlets.

Pairs of apartments share one of the 8 electric water heaters. Probably a breaker for each water heater.

All 16 apartments share one kitchen and one dining room, which use breakers not shared with the apartments.

I've seen 20 amp, 30 amp and 60 amp breakers used in other buildings; not enough access to the circuit breaker panel to check if this building does also. 240 volt circuits, using double breakers that fill the space that would otherwise be used for two single breakers, are available for high wattage appliances.

Older buildings, but seldom the newer ones, use fuses instead of circuit breakers.

Electricity for showers? We must use a different word for what you mean - our showers use only hot and cold water.

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Message 41526 - Posted: 12 Jul 2015 | 9:41:31 UTC - in response to Message 41524.


Electricity for showers? We must use a different word for what you mean - our showers use only hot and cold water.


In the UK we have electric showers that are only connected to the cold water supp;ly. The water is heated within the shower unit on demand.

Of course we also have the same type as yourself which is connected to the hot water supply.

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Message 41527 - Posted: 12 Jul 2015 | 10:38:58 UTC - in response to Message 41526.


Electricity for showers? We must use a different word for what you mean - our showers use only hot and cold water.


In the UK we have electric showers that are only connected to the cold water supp;ly. The water is heated within the shower unit on demand.

Of course we also have the same type as yourself which is connected to the hot water supply.


We have those too but call them 'point of use electric water heaters'. They are becoming the new thing as keeping hot water hot in a tank can be a waste of money. I put an electric timer on my water heater so it only heats up, and stays hot, during the hours I am most likely to be using it, morning and evening. The water stays plenty hot enough for a couple of showers in between cycles. My dishwasher, and most modern ones, comes with it own built in heater so it will pause the cycle if the water isn't hot enough, and then heat it up and continue all on its own. That let me lower the temp in the hot water heater too, saving me a bit more energy.

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Message 42138 - Posted: 10 Nov 2015 | 14:31:30 UTC

Finally, an answer from the owner. All three of the buildings have only one circuit breaker for each apartment, and all three have no more room in the circuit breaker panels to add another circuit breaker.

Months ago, GPUGRID had a link to some company that offers computers with three GPU board slots. I've lost that link since. Their computers were offered mainly for gaming. Do any of you know which company that was?

I'm also looking at some HP computers that will have more CPU cores, each hyperthreadable. Hard to find information on how much power they would use, though.

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Message 42259 - Posted: 1 Dec 2015 | 13:11:36 UTC

I found the information on how to find power supply ratings for HP computers where this isn't something you can choose when configuring the computer.

On the store.hp.com web page where you have selected which model of computer and would normally click Customize & buy, click Specs instead to find more ratings. Scroll down to Power Supply.

I've found an HP model with a power supply only a little above the maximum rating I was planning; I'm looking into whether changing the CFL light bulbs in my apartment to LED bulbs will free enough power to make that model acceptable.

On another subject, do you know of any computer brands other than HP that will stand the 24/7 heavy use needed to run both GPUGRID and some CPU BOINC projects?

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Message 42265 - Posted: 1 Dec 2015 | 17:52:13 UTC - in response to Message 42259.
Last modified: 1 Dec 2015 | 17:53:02 UTC

On another subject, do you know of any computer brands other than HP that will stand the 24/7 heavy use needed to run both GPUGRID and some CPU BOINC projects?

I build my own PC's and they all run 24/7 on various BOINC projects with no problems. I use standard motherboard brands: Asus/ASRock, Gigabyte or Biostar, whatever has the features I need for that particular machine. For reliability, the most important factors are the quality of the power supply and the ventilation, both of the case and the CPU and GPU.

For power supplies, I use Seasonic or more recently the Rosewill Gold models; you want a high-efficiency (90%+) one to minimize heat in the case and power supply. Also, get a good CPU heatsink/fan; I usually use the 120mm ones, but a good 92mm fan will work also. And the GPU should not only have a good heatsink and fan, but not be overclocked very much (they almost always factory overclock to some extent).

Finally, be sure to get a case with good ventilation, with room for a 120 mm exhaust fan at the rear and a 120 mm side fan blowing into the GPU.

But if you have real power problems, a good uninterruptible power supply (UPS) is also required; some projects do not tolerate crashes due to power loss very well. I now use the Cyber Power "pure sine wave" ones, since the provide a sine-wave output that works better with high-efficiency power supplies that use PFC (power factor correction) circuitry.

There is nothing wrong with HP; I have used them myself, but you can do better by picking your own parts.

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Message 42271 - Posted: 1 Dec 2015 | 19:44:51 UTC - in response to Message 42265.

On another subject, do you know of any computer brands other than HP that will stand the 24/7 heavy use needed to run both GPUGRID and some CPU BOINC projects?

I build my own PC's and they all run 24/7 on various BOINC projects with no problems. I use standard motherboard brands: Asus/ASRock, Gigabyte or Biostar, whatever has the features I need for that particular machine. For reliability, the most important factors are the quality of the power supply and the ventilation, both of the case and the CPU and GPU.

For power supplies, I use Seasonic or more recently the Rosewill Gold models; you want a high-efficiency (90%+) one to minimize heat in the case and power supply. Also, get a good CPU heatsink/fan; I usually use the 120mm ones, but a good 92mm fan will work also. And the GPU should not only have a good heatsink and fan, but not be overclocked very much (they almost always factory overclock to some extent).

Finally, be sure to get a case with good ventilation, with room for a 120 mm exhaust fan at the rear and a 120 mm side fan blowing into the GPU.

But if you have real power problems, a good uninterruptible power supply (UPS) is also required; some projects do not tolerate crashes due to power loss very well. I now use the Cyber Power "pure sine wave" ones, since the provide a sine-wave output that works better with high-efficiency power supplies that use PFC (power factor correction) circuitry.

There is nothing wrong with HP; I have used them myself, but you can do better by picking your own parts.


How can I pick parts so that the motherboard, the graphics board, the power supply, and the case will be known in advance to work together, with NO metal cutting? That question is the main reason I don't choose the parts myself yet.

My power problems are mostly strong limits on how much total power my computers can use; I already use a UPS for each of them, since one of the BOINC projects they participate in has been know to have workunits run for 6 months with NO checkpoints.

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Message 42272 - Posted: 1 Dec 2015 | 20:30:33 UTC - in response to Message 42271.

How can I pick parts so that the motherboard, the graphics board, the power supply, and the case will be known in advance to work together, with NO metal cutting? That question is the main reason I don't choose the parts myself yet.

My power problems are mostly strong limits on how much total power my computers can use; I already use a UPS for each of them, since one of the BOINC projects they participate in has been know to have workunits run for 6 months with NO checkpoints.


https://pcpartpicker.com/parts/partlist/

This site will tell you what is compatible and what is not... as well as parts that have not been tested for compatibility.

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Message 42275 - Posted: 2 Dec 2015 | 0:45:33 UTC - in response to Message 42272.
Last modified: 2 Dec 2015 | 0:46:20 UTC

https://pcpartpicker.com/parts/partlist/

This site will tell you what is compatible and what is not... as well as parts that have not been tested for compatibility.


I tried that site. It seemed to go well until it was time to pick a power supply; then its list of suitable power supplies that met the wattage limit was empty.

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Message 42277 - Posted: 2 Dec 2015 | 5:36:48 UTC - in response to Message 42271.

On another subject, do you know of any computer brands other than HP that will stand the 24/7 heavy use needed to run both GPUGRID and some CPU BOINC projects?

I build my own PC's and they all run 24/7 on various BOINC projects with no problems. I use standard motherboard brands: Asus/ASRock, Gigabyte or Biostar, whatever has the features I need for that particular machine. For reliability, the most important factors are the quality of the power supply and the ventilation, both of the case and the CPU and GPU.

For power supplies, I use Seasonic or more recently the Rosewill Gold models; you want a high-efficiency (90%+) one to minimize heat in the case and power supply. Also, get a good CPU heatsink/fan; I usually use the 120mm ones, but a good 92mm fan will work also. And the GPU should not only have a good heatsink and fan, but not be overclocked very much (they almost always factory overclock to some extent).

Finally, be sure to get a case with good ventilation, with room for a 120 mm exhaust fan at the rear and a 120 mm side fan blowing into the GPU.

But if you have real power problems, a good uninterruptible power supply (UPS) is also required; some projects do not tolerate crashes due to power loss very well. I now use the Cyber Power "pure sine wave" ones, since the provide a sine-wave output that works better with high-efficiency power supplies that use PFC (power factor correction) circuitry.

There is nothing wrong with HP; I have used them myself, but you can do better by picking your own parts.


How can I pick parts so that the motherboard, the graphics board, the power supply, and the case will be known in advance to work together, with NO metal cutting? That question is the main reason I don't choose the parts myself yet.

My power problems are mostly strong limits on how much total power my computers can use; I already use a UPS for each of them, since one of the BOINC projects they participate in has been know to have workunits run for 6 months with NO checkpoints.


When you are buying parts read the reviews. Concentrate on bad ones.

When you are buying individual components look at the form factor. An ATX PSU will fit in ATX case, so will an ATX motherboard.

My recomendation for PSU's is "BEQUIET" they are exceptionally quiet, reliable and "LONGLASTING", Vorsprung durch Technik.

Rocket Science it isn't. Building computers and fitting optimal components is something I would leave to plenty of research and a 13 year old.

Why anybody would employ UPS for BOINC escapes me. If you are running something FAR more important fair enough.

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Message 42278 - Posted: 2 Dec 2015 | 5:46:55 UTC - in response to Message 42277.

Why anybody would employ UPS for BOINC escapes me. If you are running something FAR more important fair enough.

You use a UPS when you need them. I often put the BOINC data folder on a ramdisk, or use a write-cache for BOINC projects that write a lot to the disk drive (I use SSDs). Some projects can write over 1TB/day, and a ramdisk protects the SSD, and usually reduces errors as well. But if you have a power outage, you lose data and often corrupt the files with a ramdisk. In that case, if you don't have a UPS, you will wish that you did.

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Message 42288 - Posted: 3 Dec 2015 | 17:13:09 UTC - in response to Message 42277.
Last modified: 3 Dec 2015 | 17:15:24 UTC

Why anybody would employ UPS for BOINC escapes me. If you are running something FAR more important fair enough.


Looks like you have never been interested in any BOINC project that hadn't managed to set up checkpointing yet, and had workunits much longer than the average length between even short power outages in your area.

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Message 46949 - Posted: 16 Apr 2017 | 3:33:06 UTC

The second GTX 750 Ti gave the same problem. I've since found that the problem is actually with the motherboard, a Pegatron IPISB-CH2. That model of motherboard is known for having problems booting properly when using any Nvidia-based graphics board with a GPU of a generation more recent than the Fermi generation. It also has problems using the more recent AMD GPUs. I've decided not to use that computer for GPUGRID any more.

My newest computer, with a GTX 980, is now trying to get a GPUGRID task; none seem to be available now.

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